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The War of A.D. 1812

16 Jan

The War of 1812 [courtesy Google Images]

The War of 1812
[courtesy Google Images]

The “War of 1812” is largely a “forgotten” war.  Although a few Americans know this war was between the Great Britain and the USA, many would be surprised to learn that America declared war on Britain–the world’s only super-power of that era.  Americans even invaded Canada and fought against a “United States” of Indian tribes. Few of us understand this war’s causes, personalities, or consequences.

For most of us, this war is presumed to be a minor anecdote in American history somewhat akin to our invasion of the island of Grenada in A.D. 1983. In fact, this war was often characterized by incompetent generals, cowardly militia members and idiotic choices.  There’s no clear victor.  The only real losers were the American Indians.  This war wasn’t won by any side so much as simply discontinued when Britain finally defeated Napoleon at Waterloo..

Even so, the “War of 1812” may have been our single, most important war since it established America’s ability to fight as a nation, to survive, to defeat the world’s only super-power, and even laid the foundation for much of what later became the American “character”.

This war is strange in that at least three extraordinary events (a hurricane, a tornado, and the Battle of New Orleans wherein over 2,000 British soldiers died while Andrew Jackson’s numerically-inferior forces suffered just 13 deaths) took place that seem virtually impossible without God’s intervention.  I doubt that American has God’s blessing today.  I’m sure we had it in A.D. 1812.

I know you’re busy and you probably won’t take time to watch this 2.5 hour documentary on the “War of 1812”.  But you should.  It’s worth your time.  It’s worth your kids’ time. It’s the story of heroes and fools and the Hand of God.  It’s well-done, informative and sometimes inspiring.  Unlike the past several administrations in Washington, DC, this video can remind you of what it means to be an American.  It can even help rekindle a sense of national pride.

There was a time when America was splendid.  That time now seems gone.  But it might come again if we can remember and embrace the values seen in this video..

 
80 Comments

Posted by on January 16, 2014 in Video, War

 

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80 responses to “The War of A.D. 1812

  1. Applessence

    January 16, 2014 at 10:34 PM

    I thought I had learned the war of 1812 resulted from America defaulting on its loans (from Bank of England,, no less) for financing the American Revolution against….England! My understanding is England came to collect on the American bankruptcy.

    I read that the loans would be forgiven or forgotten, if Bank of England were allowed to be the central bank of America. At first, there was a resounding NO!, but apparently at some point, America caved in, accepted the terms, and the British left here with all of their weapons, soldiers, ships, etc., in tact, and that was the end of the ‘war’.

    I will see if I can find the article, if you are interested.

     
    • palani

      January 17, 2014 at 8:03 AM

      @ Applessence

      The source of the loans that England was collecting on was France. If you read the diplomatic papers of the U.S. published during that period you will find that the U.S. essentially defaulted on payment of its loans to France and to help its neighbor out England stepped in to purchase those loans. That put England in a position of financing its own American revolution.

       
    • Christian Gains

      January 26, 2014 at 5:31 PM

      Yes Applesause, PLEASE DO see if you can find it! I JUST today read this, and you’re version is VERY CLOSE to the one I’ve read…War is ALMOST always about profits and $$$$ acquisition.

       
  2. Martens

    January 16, 2014 at 11:54 PM

    Cause of the War of 1812 (cliff notes):

    The charter for the privately owned “Bank of the United States” would soon expire in 1811, and Congress votes against its renewal thanks to the influence of Thomas Jefferson and Andrew Jackson.

    Andrew Jackson in 1811: “If Congress has a right under the Constitution to issue paper money, it was given them to use by themselves, not to be delegated to individuals or corporations.”

    Nathan Rothschild of the Bank of England: “Either the application for the renewal of the charter is granted, or the United States will find itself involved in a most disastrous war.”

    Standing fast, Congress lets the charter expire anyway.

    The War of 1812 results.

     
    • EDOMS THORN

      January 17, 2014 at 3:02 PM

      The “Rothschilds” are of EDOM!

      …”For us today, we must be reminded that it was the race of Edom which Rome expelled from Palestine in 70 A.D.; who migrated to Spain (becoming Sephardim) and to eastern Russia (Khazaria & later becoming Ashkenaz). Those so-called Jews exploited Europe through the centuries and were many times expelled from European countries. It was those Jews who manipulated King George to exact outrageous taxation on the new American colonies, along with forcing the King to conduct a slave-trade which the colonists did not want. The King was trying to pay off a tremendous usurious debt to the Jew banks by squeezing the Christians of this new land”…
      READ more at >>>
      http://www.divinepageant.com/

      Now EDOM is a usurper and infiltrator and as The Messiah pointed out, they “proselytize” many into their Talmudic Religion, they did convert the Ashenazis but that does not eliminate EDOM from being those of Revelation 2:9 and 3:9…

      There may be a FEW of JUDAH/JACOB that call themselves “JEWS” today but here are those that Jesus called impostors in Revelation 2:9, 3:9
      http://www.edomsthorn.wordpress.com
      EXPOSING the Gods CHOSEN™ People MYTH

       
      • Tony

        January 20, 2014 at 9:03 PM

        Hi Edoms Thorn,

        What you are sharing is interesting to me. This is the first time I ever heard the idea the Sephardic and the Ashkenazi share the same lineage. Are you sure about that?

        Also, if the Ashkenazi shared the same religious beliefs as the Sephardic, why would they need to be converted?

        Tony

         
      • EDOMS THORN

        January 22, 2014 at 4:27 PM

        Thank you AL ADASK! You have the best commenter’s on the WEB.

        TONY I am so glad you responded to my comment! You prompted me to re-examine the Sephardic JEWS.

        The ‘body’ of that qoute from Rodger Hathaway, as I linked to it, was the WHY I posted it, but you found a question in it that did need to be addressed, and I have had the answer all the time, to be found in the Book of OBADIAH and I over looked it. As I pointed out in the introdution to the link to my article concerning EDOM, I have always believed that there are some of JUDAH today that call themselves “JEWS”. I have said since around 1985 that those JEWS (targetted by the EDOMITE Zionist’s that had manipulated W.W. II to aide in the creation of “their”Jewish Homeland) murdered in the “Holocaust” were of JUDAH. I had since read from many EDOMITE Jewish source’s that they considered so “JEWS” to be lesser Jews. I understand that Sephardic children were subjected to Radiation Experiments in Israel in the 1950’s. There is more, but I never made the connection to them as being of JUDAH. But it makes so much sense now, as I understand why the Zionist EDOMITES hate “WE” the Goyim is because we are true ISRAEL, it stands to reason that the Sephardic Jewsw are of JACOB/ISRAEL also.

        I went to this site for a quick read on the Sephardic Jews, and in tit was a reference to the Book of OBADIAH. see below.
        …”The official definition of Sephardic according to Rabbi Marc Angel of Sephardic House, is “almost any Jew who is not Ashkenazi. Although there are wide cultural divergences within the Sephardic world, common liturgy and religious customs constitute underlying factors of unity.”…
        http://www.jewishgen.org/sefardsig/sephardic_roffe.HTM?

        EDOM has taken possession of Jerusalem as they did in Jesus’ day. Obadiah deals with EDOMS impersonation of JACOB/ ISRAEL and their destruction at the hands of Jacob and Joseph, the true Israelite western Nations, see verse 18.

        Obadiah 1:20 “And the captivity of this host of the children of Israel shall possess that of the Canaanites, even unto Zarephath; and the captivity of Jerusalem, which is in Sepharad, shall possess the cities of the south.”

        Verse 20 is talking about after EDOM has been expelled from Jerusalem and the land to be occupied by Jacobs seed again.
        AND in my face, for so long, …”the captivity of Jerusalem, which is in Sepharad”…

        Here is a link I found that give a deeper look at EDOM than my article.
        Remove the “&” and push it to make a link!!
        http: & //www.mission to israel. org/ mystery-of-gentiles/chapter10.php

        Thanks Tony!!! LET me now if you read this… I do not see a “reply button” for your comment…

        E.T.

         
      • Christian Gains

        January 26, 2014 at 5:45 PM

        Tony! Get, and read Arthur Koestler’s Book: “The Thirteenth Tribe” — This is a HIGHLY ACCLAIMED Historian’s scholarly dissertation on the “proselytizing” (by Jews) of the Empire of the Khazar, [Eastern Russia, Norther Asia Minor, located above the Caspian Sea, and between the Black Sea, and Sea of Aral], and how these proselytes eventually morphed into the Eshkanazi. It’s fascinating, and EXTREMELY pertinent to the issue of “Who’s a ‘Jew’?”, as well as the other significant question: “Who ARE Yahwey’s ‘chosen people'”?.

         
      • J.M.

        February 7, 2014 at 5:31 PM

        @ So that is TWO times that your reading comprehension skills appear to be questionable.

        Ok, I agree and the good news is, it will be foolish & a waste of your time & energy to try & correspond with me or ANYONE, I would think, whose reading comprehension skills appear to be questionable. What I’m trying to say is, I’m not worth fooling with. Is there a way I may send you a donation to help cover the expense of your research, etc.? Hopefully I will be able to understand your instructions as to how to do that, hopefully, that is. Have a wonderful life, I think this is better than saying, have a nice day, don’t you ? If you do respond, just tell me how I go about supporting your cause. I’m certain there will be other high level readers with high level understanding who will benefit from your website. I would like to be worth something so I guess that would be my selfish reason for wanting to help at least as much as I can which I also know is not much help, still, it’s the best I can do. Sometimes other people’s comments do not show up on my computer until after I post mine & sometimes I have a BIG problem even getting anything through. Guess what, I am a Hebrew too. Isn’t the name, Alfred, a Hebrew name, I think it is. But I do know this for sure, you sure are a THORN in the side of EDOM. Oh yes, do you say you are born again like Christian Gains says SHE is? I’m serious I do not want or mean to be no-z, but it seems to me IF you are born again, you would be proud of it, & proud to let the whole wide world KNOW It. Am I Right,or no

         
      • J.M.

        February 8, 2014 at 1:26 PM

        @The “Rothschilds” are of EDOM!

        WOW !!! Knowing this truth should bring on the radical change we need in gov-co. The missing key is now revealed & opens the door to freedom.THANK YOU EDOMS THORN !!!!

         
      • EDOMS THORN

        February 8, 2014 at 1:58 PM

        When I got the notice that you had commented just now, I was thinking about if I was even going to respond to anything more than “Born Again”. Because of what you said, …”it will be foolish & a waste of your time & energy to try & correspond with me or ANYONE”… it appeared to me that you were playing the ‘victim’ in this.

        I believe hat if we are to have a conversation, we owe it to each other to READ and give thought to what is read, and then comment with UNDERSTANDING what we read. Also, a comment that does not speak to the others comment or point is NOT in my opinion a conversation at all, but just a distraction from those points and only clogs up the ‘comment section with a lot of BLAH Blah. And correcting spelling and commenting how some are called to correct spelling is pure BLAH Blah.

        @The “Rothschilds” are of EDOM!

        I belive that understanding EDOM is the KEY to understanding the N.W.O. The Bible leads me to believe that there is GENOCIDE coming upon True ISRAEL.
        Matthew 24:22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened.

        HIS word says that ISRAEL would be “called by a new name” and that name is CHRISTIAN. ISRAEL are the “ELECT”

        The word “ISRAEL” occurs 2568 times in 2294 verses in the KJV, and not one time is ISRAEL called “JEW” The Book of Romans is largely about Gods love for ISRAEL/Jacob and the word “JEW” is used there ten times and not one time is it used for ISRAEL. WHY NOT?
        NEVER in the entire Bible are the so called JEWS called “Gods Chosen”
        The word “JEW” in scripture, NO WHERE denote “FAITH or Religion.
        “JEW” means Judean and is used for one son of Jacob/ISRAEL JUDAH.
        1 Chronicles 16:13 O ye seed of Israel his servant, ye children of Jacob, his chosen ones.

        Psalm 135:4 For the Lord hath chosen Jacob unto himself, and Israel for his peculiar treasure.

        Isaiah 41:8 But thou, Israel, art my servant, Jacob whom I have chosen, the seed of Abraham my friend.

        Isaiah 44:1 Yet now hear, O Jacob my servant; and Israel, whom I have chosen:

        Isaiah 45:4 For Jacob my servant’s sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.

        AND the “elect” are ISRAEL! Not JEWS!

        In “GENOCIDE, INFESTATION, INFILTRATION: The Beginning” I lay out the facts concerning those that were in Babylonian Captivity. And the first attempt to Genocide some of those of True ISRAEL by EDOM >
        http://www.edomsthorn.wordpress.com/2014/02/05/genocide-infestation-infiltration-the-beginning/

         
      • J.M.

        February 8, 2014 at 2:47 PM

        To: EDOMS THORN

        @ > When I got the notice that you had commented just now, I was thinking about if I was even going to respond to anything more than “Born Again”……….”

        1. >Please do share your thoughts about what “Born Again” means/is,etc.

        2. > I am serious about the “donation” I want to make to you & I have tried to explain why. Once again, you have valuable information & truthful information. I want to, in all honesty, help “defer” the costs, your out of pocket costs, to help just at least a tad bit, & by this, I mean, what I can send may only be a tad bit compared to what your expenses are. I will do the best I can in that regard.

        3.> SO, Please do share your thoughts about what “Born Again” means/is,etc.,AND,

        4.> Advise me on how to help you financially to keep your website up & running.

        I am requesting two things in this message as is showing above. Let’s go/start with these 2 requests. I am asking you, E.T., for an answer for two things,supra.

         
      • EDOMS THORN

        February 8, 2014 at 5:20 PM

        J.M.

        Sorry so late. In June the son inlaw abandoned our daughter and two children that have moved in with us, and they are a big distraction to say the least.

        I must admit to being a bit hard on you, I have about had it with those kind of encounters that are not productive and what I find to be to distracting. The Christian Zionist’s are the worst! LOL

        I worked this up last night concerning ‘Born Again’ and we agree. I think that term as it is used today is relatively new. I never liked it as it is used. It made me think that those that use that term, used it to set themselves up to a ‘preeminent’ position above all who were not saved or ‘claimed’ that term for themselves. As in PIOUS righteousness!

        John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
        John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit”.

        That is plain to me.

        Colossians 1:17- And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
        Paul said of the Messiah
        Christ is the firstborn “from the dead.”

        Revelation 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

        1 Corinthians 15:50-51 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed”
        OR “translated into the Kingdom of God Colossians 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son”…

        The use of that term to me also to promote the “Once saved always saved” LIE!

        Revelation 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

        Revelation 13:8 (in part)…”And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

        Revelation 17:8 whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
        There are many besides that from Revelation, but I like those because it is the FINAL word!

        Now to your very kind concern consideration for my ‘expenses’.
        Proverbs 23:23 “Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding”.

        There is a “DONATE” button that I could put up on my site, but I do hate the idea of using it, and I question other sites that use it. Especially WordPress sites because it is FREE to operate.
        My only expense is my Internet connection. And I am struggling now more than before to keep things up and running around here, with the Grand kids and prices going up on everything, but we are making it for now. My wife is a good PROVERBS wife and she takes good ‘care’ on the spending.

        If you are sincere, and do see what I am talking about is important, please except my apologies for the rudeness. BUT my position on those points still remain the same. I am a serious man that tries to stay focused, and I speak what’s on my mind in PLAIN ENGLISH!

        Thank you for you reply.

        I.H.S.

        E.T.
        My email is lazarusliveslong@hotmail.com

         
      • J.M.

        February 8, 2014 at 7:23 PM

        To: Edoms Thorn
        Shalom, & thank you for your heartfelt & CLEAR, to me, message on/of Feb.8, 5:20 pm If any of this message posts & you see any part of it in italics, this means, from my past experiences, only part of it posted & if this message posts with any part in italics, it will be one mass cycle of confusion. So give me the chance to at least straighten it out or TRY to.

        E.T., Now we are cooking with fire, not a wire. I will respond as best as I can

        @ “…….In June the son in law abandoned our daughter and two children that have moved in with us, and they are a big distraction to say the least.

        My heart goes out to you, E.T. & I know what to say the least means, yes indeed I do

        @ > “……………….. I have about had it with those kind of encounters that are not productive and what I find to be to distracting. The Christian Zionist’s are the worst! LOL

        You, E.T., are TRYING HARD to WAKE, at least some of US ISRAELITES UP, that’s all. You are LIFTING UP YOUR “LAST CALL” boys & girls, WAKE UP call !!! I worked this up last night concerning ‘Born Again’ and we agree. I think that term as it is used today is relatively new. I never liked it as it is used. It made me think that those that use that term, used it to set themselves up to a ‘preeminent’ position above all who were not saved or ‘claimed’ that term for themselves. As in PIOUS righteousness!

        E.T. you may have just lost the “other heavyweight” scholarly lady with that “pious righteousness” remark.. BUT, I agree & I also think it’s a bit haughty for some people to think of himself/herself as such. Not only pious, but haughty. I will prove this later.

        @ > John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
        John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit”.
        That is plain to me.

        ME TOO !!! But some of “us” cannot let well enough & plain enough alone.

        @ > Colossians 1:17- And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
        Paul said of the Messiah
        Christ is the firstborn “from the dead.”

        Christ is the firstborn “from the dead” !!!! OH NO !!!! We just can’t have this clear scripture stay AS IS. 1 Corinthians 15:50-51 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed”
        OR “translated into the Kingdom of God Colossians 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son”…

        The use of that term to me also to promote the “Once saved always saved” LIE!

        YES INDEED !! I think the Apostle Paul said, lest I myself should become a castaway, But if I am wrong about who it was, who did say this,”lest I myself” become a castaway, this is where there are, those “others” who will correct me & say I should not be paraphrasing, & tell me WHO it was, etc. Revelation 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

        Revelation 13:8 (in part)…”And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

        Revelation 17:8 whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
        There are many besides that from Revelation, but I like those because it is the FINAL word!

        YOU BETCHA

        @ >Now to your very kind concern consideration for my ‘expenses’.
        Proverbs 23:23 “Buy the truth, and sell it not; also wisdom, and instruction, and understanding”.

        The scriptures also tell me that I have received freely & I should give freely.

        @ > There is a “DONATE” button that I could put up on my site, but I do hate the idea of using it, and I question other sites that use it. Especially WordPress sites because it is FREE to operate.
        My only expense is my Internet connection. And I am struggling now more than before to keep things up and running around here, with the Grand kids and prices going up on everything, but we are making it for now. My wife is a good PROVERBS wife and she takes good ‘care’ on the spending.

        If enough people cared, you would not need to put such a button up. WELL I CARE.

        @ >If you are sincere, and do see what I am talking about is important, please except my apologies for the rudeness. BUT my position on those points still remain the same. I am a serious man that tries to stay focused, and I speak what’s on my mind in PLAIN ENGLISH!

        We both apparently TRY so hard & in doing so, & being frustrated, exasperated, aggravated, to put it mildly, we sometimes just don’t express ourselves correctly or properly. I myself did this to a precious Timmy & Julie but Julie said to me, later, “I like you very much.”
        I will try tomorrow to contact you via email. I cannot get through to dejure & moon, 2 other posters who posted their email addresses. Also, I am going to try to send you a letter, on this blog addressed to “Saul Paul” that will make you laugh heartily, IF you are not already familiar
        with it Don’t let the heading of it throw you a curve. It will be made plain as you read & laugh, & you will. Shalom EDOMS THORN aka E.T.
        Thank you for you reply.

         
      • J.M.

        February 8, 2014 at 8:12 PM

        To; EDOMS THORN,
        Once again, My LAST message to you, Re: Born Again, did not post completely & I did not put anything in italics & it was somewhat out of order. I may be making the mistake of thinking since I know what it meant, this does not mean you might not have a problem understanding at least some part of it. My response was always UNDER your part of your message that I cut & pasted but my response did not post as I wrote it. It was intermingled with your message. It never fails. Hopefully the following letter to “Saul Paul” will all post. If so, you will “enjoy it.”

        Rev. Saul Paul
        Independent Missionary
        Corinth, Greece

        Dear Mr. Paul,

        We recently received an application from you for service under our Board.

        It is our policy to be as frank and open-minded as possible with all our applicants. We have made an exhaustive survey of your case. To be plain, we are surprised that you have been able to “pass” as a bonafide missionary.

        We are told that you are afflicted with severe eye-trouble. This is certain to be an insuperable handicap to an effective ministry. Our Board requires 20/20 vision.

        At Antioch, we learn, you opposed Dr. Simon Peter, an esteemed home missionary and actually rebuked him publicly. You stirred up so much trouble at Antioch that a special Board meeting had to be convened in Jerusalem. We cannot condone such actions.

        Do you think it seemly for a missionary to do part-time secular work? We hear that you are making tents on the side. In a letter to the church at Phillipi, you admitted that they were the only church supporting you. We wonder why.

        Is it true that you have a jail record? Certain brethren report that you did two years time at Caesarea and were imprisoned at Rome.

        You made so much trouble for the business men at Ephesus that they refer to you as “the man who turned the world upside down.” Sensationalism, in missions, is uncalled for. We also deplore the lurid “over-the-wall-in-a-basket” episode at Damascus.

        We are appalled at your obvious lack of conciliatory behavior. Diplomatic men are not stoned and dragged out of the city gates, or assaulted by furious mobs. Have you ever suspected that gentler words might gain you more friends? I enclose a copy of Dalius Carnagus’ book, “How To Win Jews and influence Greeks.”

        In one of your letters, you refer to yourself as “Paul the aged.” Our new mission policies do not envisage a surplus of superannuated recipients.

        We understand that you are given to fantasies and dreams. At Troas, you saw “a man of Macedonia” and at another time “were caught up into the third heaven” and even claimed “the Lord stood by” you. We reckon that more realistic and practical minds are needed in the task of world evangelism.

        You have caused much trouble everywhere you have gone. You opposed the honorable women at Berea and the leaders of your own nationality in Jerusalem. If a man cannot get along with his own people, how can he serve foreigners? We learn that you are a snake-handler. At Malta, you picked up a poisonous serpent which is said to have bitten you, but you did not suffer harm. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk!

        You admit that while you were serving time at Rome that “all forsook you.” Good men are not left friendless. Three fine brothers, by the names of Diotrephes, Demas and Alexander, the coppersmith, have notarized affidavits to the effect that it is impossible for them to cooperate with either you or your program.

        We know that you had a bitter quarrel with a fellow missionary named Barnabas. Harsh words do not further God’s work.

        You have written many letters to churches where you have formerly been pastor. In one of the letters, you accused a church member of living with his father’s wife, and you caused the whole church to feel badly; and the poor fellow was expelled.

        You spend too much time talking about “the second coming of Christ.” Your letters to the people at Thessalonica were almost entirely devoted to this theme. Put first things first from now on.

        Your ministry has been far too flighty to be successful. First Asia Minor, then Macedonia, then Greece, then Italy and now you are talking about a wild goose chase into Spain. Concentration is more important than dissipation of one’s powers. You cannot win the whole world by yourself. You are just one little Paul.

        In a recent sermon, you said “God forbid that I should glory in anything save the cross of Christ.” It seems to us that you also ought to glory in our heritage, our denominational program, the unified budget, our Cooperative Program and the World Federation of Churches.

        Your sermons are much too long for the times. At one place, you talked until after midnight and a young man was so asleep that he fell out of the window and broke his neck. Nobody is saved after the first twenty minutes any way. “Stand up, speak up and then shut up,” is our advice.

        Dr. Luke reports that you are a thin little man, bald, frequently sick and always so agitated over your church that you sleep very poorly. He reports that you pad around the house praying half the night. A healthy mind in a robust body is our ideal for all applicants. A good night’s sleep will give you zest and zip so that you wake full of zing.

        We find it best to send only married men into foreign service. We deplore your policy of persistent celibacy. Simon Magus has set up a matrimonial bureau at Samaria, where the names of some very fine widows are available.

        You wrote recently to Timothy that “you had fought a good fight.” Fighting is hardly a recommendation for a missionary. No fight is a good fight. Jesus came, not to bring a sword, but peace. You boast that “I fought with wild beasts at Ephesus.” What on earth do you mean?

        It hurts me to tell you this, Brother Paul, but in all of my twenty-five years experience, I have never met a man so opposite to the requirements of our Foreign Mission Board. If we accepted you, we would break every rule of modern missionary practice.

        Most Sincerely yours,

        J. Flavious Fluffyhead,

        Foreign Mission Board Secretary

        Paul says,> 1st Corinthians 2:14: “But the natural (psuchikos in the Greek) man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”
        Courtesy of, Richard Anthony, http://www.ecclesia.org.

         
      • J.M.

        February 9, 2014 at 4:45 PM

        EDOMS THORN
        @ So that is TWO times that your reading comprehension skills appear to be questionable.

        YOU ARE 100% CORRECT. Both you, & the lady DID mention Deut.28 BEFORE I did. I still think I gave a pretty good comment about Deut. 28. BUT, E.T. You are right. IF I was born again I think, NO !! I KNOW I would not have made that superduper error. ANYWAY, did you get my email?

         
      • EDOMS THORN

        February 9, 2014 at 4:54 PM

        J.M.

        No email yet. I have seen some come in three or four hours after being sent. I am sure I gave you the correct address. I know it better than my home address.

        What did you mean when you called yourself a “Hebrew”?

         
      • J.M.

        February 9, 2014 at 9:38 PM

        @ >Christ is the firstborn “from the dead.”

        E.T. We MUST do something about this scripture to make it mean ANYTHING other that what it plainly says. We can’t have this, leave it alone, “as it is” because there may be people who will think about it, & see, E.T., especially the “firstborn from the dead” might suggest for others, who endure unto the end, those who DO overcome, a second birth, or born from the dead,which would imply 2 births, one being of flesh & the 2nd birth, being born of spirit, which would be in harmony with the other scriptures which say, that which is born of the flesh is flesh & that which is born of the spirit is spirit, Now, we can’t have this !!! It’s intolerable !!! We have to do something to make it mean ANYTHING other than what it plainly says. People might wake up, although it is still doubtful, however, cannot take that chance.This implies, to say the least, two births, born ONCE of flesh, & the 2nd birth, born of SPIRIT.
        Jesus THE Christ being the FIRSTBORN of many brethren, to follow, in the first resurrection, still ahead. NOW, we both know E.T. that some will say, the first resurrection “must have already happened.” Their chests are swelling up right now as they, IF they are reading this,& they are proud in their arrogance of being challenged or even questioned.about being born again as to the meaning. IT MEANS what THEY SAY IT MEANS because they say the bible says it means they are born again.There are ways to get around these plain as the nose on your face scriptures, when Satan has his agents to tell us what they really mean. I think Satan quoted scripture to Jesus too trying to trip Jesus up. Wasn’t it the Apostle Paul who said, “lest I MYSELF should become a castaway? How could Paul even think such a thing?? Wasn’t Paul BORN AGAIN??? Poor Paul, tsk tsk tsk

         
      • J.M.

        February 9, 2014 at 10:06 PM

        E.T
        1 Cor 9:27 > “But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.”

        I see I left out the word WE, in my last at this time message to you, E.T.. We cannot take the chance, is how it should have read. The confusing thing is, people don’t remotely understand what born again, being born again, is & means. Then again, they do know what it means & they know they know. And even if what we show what the scriptures SAY, makes sense to them, they are too PROUD to say they were in error. I hate that word > PROUD < I HATE IT. I love the word, humble. This what I am trying & trusting to be & become.

         
      • J.M.

        February 10, 2014 at 12:35 AM

        EDOMS THORN
        First, I cut & pasted this email address,> lazarusliveslong@hotmail.com. I wrote you a message & clicked on send. Instantly, a notice popped up that said, “message sent.” Actually, I have sent 2 messages to you, OR thought it was you I was sending the messages to. I go to my “sent” box & they are in there. BUT, if the above is not your email address, they went to somebody else. E.T. We all have our own style of writing & saying things. IF my style offends you, tell me. You will not offend me by saying it does. I will still send you a donation because I said I would. I don’t have to say this. Yes, I do try to insert humor,etc., & sometimes, reverse psychology, in my style & as is proving, am only making a bigger FOOL of myself. Christians Gains will agree with that statement Christian Gains ignores this scripture,> Matthew 5:22 >NIV > But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell. Christian Gains sent me this. Prov. 12:15; 13:16; 17:28; 18:2; 24:7; 28:4; AND 28:5 — (give THOSE TWO VERSES some prayer)…26:8….27:22………………………………….We’re done ”
        the primary point in all the above scriptures is, The 7 Chapters & verses above say, in pertinent part, FOOL, FOOL, FOOL, FOOL, FOOL, FOOL, FOOL

        Now, E.T. Maybe, just maybe if you read my message to you again, the “Big Difference” one, you might see it a little different. I say MIGHT see it differently.

        @ >What did you mean when you called yourself a “Hebrew”?
        What do you think I should I call myself? You have called me other things. & say I have, what was it, oh yes, characteristics of a TROLL., among other things.You, E.T. tell me why you know I am, or may be in error, on the Hebrew claim, AND I just might be. On the other hand, I just might be aware of “some” things you might not think I am. I do know this. Most people despise me when I tell them I am a Hebrew. I’m not PROUD of it, but, I am pleased with it even tho I do not have ANY friends because of it. I hear things like, how can you possibly & openly profess to be G.D. JEW. Some people are not only PROUD they’re STUPID to the nth degree. I confess that I am stupid too. There are degrees of everything. I knew one 33rd degree Mason. One of the most kindhearted people you or anyone could ever hope to meet. I am somewhat familiar with Joseph & his two sons. I am somewhat familiar with Great Britaine & the U.S. A . too. I said somewhat, now, so please don’t presume I am saying I know a lot. but I do think I know enough about my lineage. HOWEVER, I always stand to be corrected, and you are one of the masters when it comes to that. I.for one, appreciate your correction. I feel sorry for the correction of Christian Gains. AND I have several more scriptures that Christian Gains doesn’t approve of I think it’s in the Book of James, where it speaks of faith AND works, e.g. I’ll show you my faith by my works. I have to take into consideration ALL ALL ALL SCRIPTURE. I am not a cherry picker. Shalom

         
  3. TORNasunder

    January 17, 2014 at 4:22 PM

    Thanks for the link, I now have my evenings relaxation viewing. I will admit I know little about this war and I consider myself a history buff. I do remember that this war was barely covered in my public schooling. Especially the fact that Washington DC was sacked and many governmental building set afire including the White House.

     
    • J.M.

      January 17, 2014 at 10:25 PM

      TORNasunder
      @ > the White House.
      If “some” people understood the purpose & meaning of WHY it was originally, in its inception called the White House, it would not be called that/this today. Most people think it is called the “white house” because & ONLY because it is PAINTED white.Today it should be painted half white & half black. Paint the columns with the colors of/in the rainbow: But they won’t do it, it might let the cat out of the bag. They can’t take that chance, at least just yet. Do I sound like a racist? Well I’m not but sometimes when we tell the truth, it is understood to be racist talk. On the other hand, if believing in ethnic purity is racism, then yes, I am a racist in the sense.

       
  4. Peg-Powers

    January 17, 2014 at 5:39 PM

    Hi Apple: I’m very interested.

     
  5. qu1nn

    January 18, 2014 at 9:13 AM

    any thoughts as to one of the reasons to the war was to destroy the original thirteenth ammendment (tona)?

     
    • Adask

      January 18, 2014 at 11:42 AM

      There are any number of plausible explanations for any war. Some of them may be true; some not. The study of history is similar to the study of the future in that both studies are finally based on possibilities. One historian sees history as happening one way; another historian views history another way. What is the objective truth? I don’t know. I wasn’t there at the time.

      I’m aware of the theory that the War of 1812 was initiated by our own government for the sake of preventing ratification of the original thirteenth amendment. That may have been true for some people in government, but I doubt that it was the predominate reason for that war. But who can say?

       
      • J.M.

        January 18, 2014 at 12:39 PM

        @> I’m aware of the theory that the War of 1812 was initiated by our own government for the sake of preventing ratification of the original thirteenth amendment

        IF this is true, then everything else written in “that” Constitution was, what?

         
  6. Adask

    January 18, 2014 at 4:41 PM

    Everything else in the Constitution was . . . umm . . . constitutional. All the “missing” 13th Amendment did was prevent “titles of nobility” by attaching a penalty (loss of citizenship). Titles of nobility are expressly prohibited in the body of the Constitution for both States and the federal government–but there is no express penalty in the body of the Constitution. The great significance of titles of nobility is that they grant special rights or privileges to one group that are not granted to all of the people. As such, “special interest legislation” probably qualifies as a “title of nobility” and is therefore unconstitutional. If our state and national legislatures couldn’t pass special interest legislation, they probably wouldn’t have anything to do for more than 2 months out of every years.

     
    • J.M.

      January 18, 2014 at 6:26 PM

      Alfred
      Thanks, ….ummm…., I agree
      I’ll try to be specific. IF the original 13th was to any degree a spark or cause for starting a war, not anything else written in “that” Constitution was important enough to do the same thing, not even the First or the Ninth. I like the 9th because to me it covers everything from A 2 Z Please don’t be upset with me for not knowing how to express my thoughts & beliefs clearly. I try my best to live by the ol time meaning of the Golden Rule. I wish more people would.

       
      • Adask

        January 18, 2014 at 8:56 PM

        I’m not upset.

        I wrote a small book on the missing 13th back 20 years ago. I didn’t discover that subject, but so far as I know only one other person/publication published anything (and it was only a brief column) about the “missing 13th” before I did. I wrote three substantial articles on the subject over a period of about six months, and then assembled those three articles plus photocopies of all instances known at the time of books, state constitutions, etc., that demonstrated that 26 different states and territories believed the “missing 13th” was a valid Amendment to the Constitution.

        The “missing 13th” was no small thing. It was arguably the single most important Amendment on the Constitution because it prevented “special interest legislation” wherein government could pass laws that favored some and penalized others. Without the ability to pass special interest legislation, Congress would have no ability to seek bribes and political campaign contributions from interested parties. Government could not grow unchecked. All laws would have to apply to everyone, including Congress, equally. The net result would be a Congress that would only pass a few laws (at most) every session and those laws would apply to all, not just to some. Congress would not have to be in session for more than a few weeks every year because that’s how long it would take to consider and pass those few laws that applies to everyone, equally from coast to coast.

        However, once the missing 13th Amendment was made to disappear, Congress was freed to pass special interest legislation, bribes became commonplace and Congress become openly corrupt.

        Losing that Amendment was one of the great disasters in this nation’s history. Nevertheless, I doubt that we started the war of 1812 primarily to stop enactment of the “missing 13th”. It may have been a secondary reason, but I doubt that it was primary. But I can’t prove my opinion. Your suspicions might be entirely valid while my own suspicions are mistaken.

         
  7. J.M.

    January 18, 2014 at 8:32 PM

    P.S.
    @ Everything else in the Constitution was . . . umm . . . constitutional.

    If it helps to know how I think, at least to some degree, & I may be cutting my own throat by saying this, but every time I read this statement, I laugh. But, it is a healthy, happy laugh. Sometimes, things I say are understood by “some” others to mean the exact opposite of what I was trying to say,or meant.

     
  8. J.M.

    January 19, 2014 at 5:06 PM

    @ >preventing ratification of the original thirteenth amendment

    How could it NOT have been “ratified” & yet be in at least some early State Constitutions that also included The Constitution of The United States which DID include the original 13th? Anyone who has access to a law library can,as Lyndon would say, EASILY discover this truth. I remember The State of Indiana Constitution has it. I cannot recall the date, but it would be in “that Indiana” State Constitution shortly after the ratification.

     
  9. Adask

    January 19, 2014 at 9:04 PM

    It’s been a while since I reviewed the “missing 13th” facts, inferences and opinions. But, as I recall, that Amendment was proposed by Congress about A.D. 1810. It needed to be ratified by nine (ten?) States before it could be established as a lawful Amendment to the Constitution. Eight states had ratified before the War of 1812 broke out. Three or four States had not yet voted for or against ratification. One more State’s ratification was needed.

    The War of 1812 lasted for two years, and people forgot about the proposed 13th Amendment until about A.D. 1819. The President (Monroe?) brought up the issue and sent a letter of inquiry to the remaining three (five?) States that hadn’t yet voted on whether to ratify or not to ratify. (There was no seven year limit on the ratification period. That’s interesting because, in theory, that Amendment could still be ratified today if 3/4 of the States voted to do so.)

    Of the remaining States that had not yet voted on ratification, several voted against. But Virginia had a special edition of their State Constitution printed that included a copy of the federal Constitution as an appendix. The legislature of Virginia specifically ordered that copies of the special edition be sent to the President, Secretary of State, and several other high officials (perhaps the Speaker of the House & President of the Senate; I don’t recall). This special edition of the Virginia State Constitution included what we now call the “missing 13th Amendment”. It is believed and argued that by means of publishing this special edition of their State Constitution, and specifically ordering that about five copies be sent to high officers in the federal government, the legislature of the State of Virginia served notice that Virginia had voted to ratify the first (though no “missing”) 13th Amendment. If Virginia had voted to ratify the first 13th Amendment, then sufficient States had voted to do so, and the 13th Amendment was truly ratified as a legitimate Amendment to the federal Constitution.

    This argument is supported by the fact that at least twenty-six different States and territories independently published “official” texts indicating that his first 13th Amendment was ratified from about A.D. 1820 until as late as A.D. 1866 (roughly). It may be that some of these States and territories published documents supporting ratification of the “missing” 13th for only a few of nearly 50 years when the Amendment was published as ratified. Perhaps they subsequently learned this first 13th Amendment was not properly ratified, recognized their mistake, and after a few years stopped publishing the now “missing” 13th Amendment.

    But there is no question that at least 26 States and territories published official documents indicating that the “missing 13th” was, in fact ratified. I’ve seen and possessed copies of all of those documents. I have no doubt that at least 26 States and territories believed that 13th Amendment had been ratified. If that belief was mistaken, then we are left to conclude that communications were so poor from A.D. 1820 to about A.D. 1870, that erroneous copies of the Constitution could be published for nearly 50 years.

    How could a mistake of such magnitude persist for most of 50 years? Why didn’t some President during those 50 years make a public proclamation that the first 13th Amendment was not actually ratified? If the Amendment was mistakenly published for nearly 50 years, why don’t we see evidence of this colossal error in our history books as some sort of incredible joke?

    It seems undeniable to me that Virginia did, in fact, ratify the first 13th Amendment. However, despite the fact that Virginia enacted a law to spend money to publish a new edition of their State constitution that included the US Constitution and the now “missing” 13th Amendment, and then spent money to send copies of that new State Constitution to high officers of the US government, the last I heard the Journals of legislature of the State of Virginia for a few years near A.D. 1820 (when the first 13th would’ve been ratified) are missing. Because those State Journals were missing, it was argued that there was no evidence that Virginia had never ratified the first 13th Amendment. Without those Journals, it was successfully argued that therefore the first 13th Amendment was never actually ratified and, although it had been published by 26 States and territories at various times over nearly fifty years.

    The whole issue hinges on whether Virginia did or did not ratify that first 13th Amendment back about A.D. 1820. Because the Journals of the State of Virginia are missing, the first 13th Amendment to the Constitution is also now “missing”.

    As for whether anyone could visit some state archives and “easily” discover evidence of the 13th Amendment, that might not be so easy as you suppose. Evidence of the “missing 13th Amendment” was first discovered back about A.D. 1990 by Tom Dunn and David Dodge in a library in Maine that had been built back in the 1800s. David Dodge took it upon himself to launch a one-man investigation as he drove from state archive to state archive and probably visited about 20 state archives altogether. David assembled copies of the original documents that proved that 26 States and territories had published documents in support of the ratification of the “first” 13th Amendment.

    But David only made photocopies of the texts that carried the 13th Amendment. He didn’t have the archivist at each archive issue a certificate of the document he’d uncovered. The result was a stack of unverified copies of of the relevant documents. Those copies were persuasive, but not admissible in court.

    About A.D. 1993, David went back to the same archives he’d previously visited. His intent was to create a set of verified copies of the relevant texts. He was much surprised to discover that at every archive where he’d previously found copies of the “missing 13th,” the books containing those copies were now, themselves, missing. Some person or persons had read Tom and David’s research, identified the archives where the evidence had been found, and traveled from archive to archive to eliminate that evidence.

    The allegation that someone had made the effort to remove all of these texts is evidence of how important the “missing 13th” really was. As I’ve written previously, if the “missing 13th” were still on the Constitution, there’d be no “special interest legislation” and Congress wouldn’t need to meet for more than a few weeks or months out of any given year.

    There are undoubtedly still old books in America (and perhaps even foreign countries) that prove the existence of the “missing 13th Amendment”. But those books are likely stored in some grandparent’s trunk in the corner of a basement or attic. Those books will not be “easily” discovered in any modern state archive that’s open to the public because such books have apparently been removed and presumably destroyed.

     
    • J.M.

      January 19, 2014 at 10:39 PM

      @ why don’t we see evidence of this colossal error in our history books as some sort of incredible joke?
      Cause there is a colored gentleman in the lumber business,aka the prince of the power of the air.

      Still, IF the original 13th was not “tampered with” & still “on/in the books,” then the 13th we do see would be the 14th,& the 14th would be the 15th & so on. I’m sure the “appropriate legislation” power clause beginning with & in the 13th we do have & still see,would have taken “good care” of the original 13th somewhere & sometime later via “appropriate legislation”. Congress WAS given the power to pass all laws necessary & proper….. !!! Why the necessity of another power clause, the “appropriate legislation” power clause? Was or is it because the “necessary & proper” power clause given to Congress was unnecessary & improper or insufficient to achieve the real intent & purpose of what we can also call the “war amendments?” Yes, there is most certainly a colored gentleman in the lumber business, AND there are people who comment on this blog who are qualified to clearly explain what I KNOW but do not know how to explain. palani, where are you? However, palani is not the only one on this blog who knows we have a colored gentleman in the lumber business. Why are there two power clauses? What is lacking in the first power clause giving Congress the POWER to pass ALL laws “necessary & proper?” Why is that power clause insufficient? What else do they have to have? Appropriate Legislation as a means to an end and Passing all laws necessary & proper as a means to an end are two entirely different ball games but now, merged into one, the game of FOOTBALL & we are the football.

       
      • Adask

        January 20, 2014 at 2:21 AM

        In fact, there was at least one publication what is now the “missing” 13th Amendment (I think it was in the territory (State??) of Wyoming (maybe Montana) from about A.D. 1866, that listed the first 13th Amendment as the 13th, and the modern 13th Amendment as the 14th.

         
  10. J.M.

    January 20, 2014 at 3:21 AM

    It’s the same like minds at work, kind begets kind,e.g. figures don’t lie but liars sure can figure. We ARE in A SPIRITUAL WAR !!! Even on this blog !!! There are at least two people who insist that everything holy, Just, & good was nailed to the cross. Jesus was & still is holy, just, & good & he WAS nailed to the cross But since he ain’t there,on it no more, the only thing left to do is for some to insist that everything he died for, is dead too, still nailed to the cross,abolished notwithstanding, done away with,gone,over with of no value,etc.. One man on this blog said, ” to teach obedience to the 10 commandments is false doctrine.< This is just one of many examples. They need a place to vent, & this blog is open & I think rightly so for them to spew out all the poison venom they want to. It always did take 2 to tango & there are some people on this blog who can tango just as good if not better than they can.

     
  11. EDOMS THORN

    January 22, 2014 at 4:01 PM

    I have posting problems… TESTING

     
    • J.M.

      January 22, 2014 at 10:27 PM

      Shalom,Edoms Thorn,
      Tony has a question for you, up above. I would like to know your thoughts about his question too
      Tony’s question is: > Also, if the Ashkenazi shared the same religious beliefs as the Sephardic, why would they need to be converted?
      Thank you kindly.

       
      • EDOMS THORN

        January 24, 2014 at 12:15 PM

        J.M.

        That was the question I was going to respond to when I began yet another journey into the maze of ‘rabbit holes’ that we will encounter while researching the subject of the JEWS. I became distracted by a new revelation and forgot what I had went there for.

        I was not clear on exactly what conversion, and when Tony was referring to. I take it he meant the “Gerim”, those that convert to TALMUDIC Judaism, which is from the EDOMITE (Ashkenazi if you like) JEWS that Jesus dealt with through out the New Testament. And any “Goyim” would be considered a “GERIM” not just the Sephardim.

        Matthew 15:9 – (Jesus speaking to the Pharisees and quoting Isaiah 29:13) – “But in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.” (That, my friends, is what the BABYLONIAN TALMUD is; the teachings of the Rabbis, which conflict with the teachings of Moses and the Prophets.)

        Matthew 23:13-15 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows’ houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

        I ask the question many times “Why were the JEWS expelled from every country they were found?” and I rarely get the correct answer. One of the most popular answers is “Satan hates ISRAEL” and that is from Christian Zionist’s. But the correct answer is they adhere to the Babylonian TALMUD. (Which is essentially a declaration of war on “we” the GOYIM)

        So it would appear that the Sephardic Jews in Spain had been ‘INFECTED’ with the Babylonian Talmud.

        Beyond that, I would need a bit of a clarification on the question.

        Thanks

        E.T.

         
    • J.M.

      January 24, 2014 at 7:39 PM

      EDOMS THORN
      Thank you for also knowing the meaning of 1st Peter 3:15 and honoring same. Too many Christians (??) are either unaware of that Scripture or either don’t care what it says. We do have some “cherry picker” scripture Christians. I have asked some of these people who say they are Christians, questions but they never answer. I respond to their non response, & say, I hope my question did not offend you or upset you, & I do not get an answer to that either. Anyway,THANK YOU EDOMS THORN

      @ > Matthew 23:13-15 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!

      I’m sure these scribes & pharisees had offspring that are on this earth today. Who do you think they are ? I thought they may be the “Jewish Rabbis” but I really don’t know, to be honest. Who, in your opinion or knowledge are they known as or called today? Who are the scribes, today? Who are the Pharisees,today? They must be on this earth somewhere. I hope my questions do not upset you. You may think even an idiot knows that. Well, I’m below the level of an idiot, I guess. Pretend that I am a little child, 4 0r 5 years old ashing his dad these questions. Thanks.

       
      • Christian Gains

        January 26, 2014 at 11:10 PM

        Hi J.M. & “EDOMS THORN”…I’ve just spent the better part of this day, (Jan.26) studying at your (“EDOMS THORN”) site, and I find it EXTREMELY informative, and, at the same time, (Heb.5:11 – 14) “MEAT”…ONLY meant for those: “who by reason of use, have their senses exercised to DISCERN both good and evil”, [Heb.5:14].

        I’ve spent the last 40+ years studying the Scriptures, (in Hebrew and Aramaic when possible), and your (“EDOMS THORN”), is DEEP & PROFOUND knowledge….but, (as Prov. warns: “…with all thy getting,[of wisdom/knowledge], get understanding”).

        It takes DEEP & PROFOUND understanding of this “present world”, [Eph. 6:12; & II Cor.10:4 – 5;& St. John. 16:13]; to balance the occult influences, and separate them from the Godly info.

        You do a fine job, (as long as people are willing to read the ENTIRE Article).

        I’ve always had a worry about “Middle Eastern” Mythology….mostly due to the “Mystery religion” influences, and am just now beginning to grasp the significance of Gen.1 thru 3, (dealing with the significance of the STARS)…

        But, i’m still thinking that you’re material is MUCH TOO “MEATY” for 99.9% of Christianity — (or the “Christian professing” Americans) — today.

        There’s just no doubt that we’re looking, at, & experiencing, as well as [NEED TO] be preparing for the “LAST DAYS”, as the original 11 had to prepare for their “LAST DAYS” by prayer, fasting, and obedience to HIS “still small voice”.

        “EDOMS THORN”, thank you for your hard, diligent, and scholarly work…I’ll be monitoring and studying regularly. And, sharing what I am led to share, regularly…God bless!

        Practice & perfect utilizing and claiming the (Matt.16:19) “Keys of the Kingdom” regularly, Brother/Sister! There definitely ARE “spirits’ to “bind”, and “Loose”…also ask the Lord for the authority to “open & close doors”, [Rev.3:7]…Eph. 6:12!

         
      • EDOMS THORN

        January 27, 2014 at 8:17 PM

        J.M.
        In response to your question about the Scribes and Pharisees offspring, the answer is YES! They are still in the world, and from how you asked your question it seems you understand that maybe they are JEWS today. Lets consider what Jesus said concerning them.

        Matthew 23:31-33 “Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?”

        S.C. 1081 GREEK ‘gennema’ is Greek for ‘generation’
        1) that which has been born or begotten
        a) the offspring or progeny of men or animals.

        Jesus and everyone there in His day KNEW that EDOM was in control of Jerusalem (and they are today)

        In my response to TONY above I provided a link to my article “EDOM: The Story Of Jacob And Esau Is Not Just A Story” while it is not exhaustive, there are some Biblical and Historical Facts and links that should have anyone on the path to understanding the significance of EDOM in these ‘latter days’…

        B.T.W. I am the reason that link above, that you need to fix to make it work, I am the reason it is not ‘allowed’ on ANY “W o R d P r E ss” web site! Try to post it!! LOL It is a good story.

        The problem with most people (Christians or not) is they rely more on
        what they are told to believe and what to think, than doing the study
        or research for themselves, not proving weither what they believe is
        true, or even if they have ALL of the facts. Ponder if you will, these Scriptures:

        Hosea 4:6 “My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because
        thou hast rejected knowledge”…

        II Cor. 10:12 “For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or
        compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they
        measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among
        themselves, are not wise.”
        In other words think for yourself!

        1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

        II TIMOTHY 2:15 “Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman
        that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth”.
        DIVIDING:
        SC GREEK 3718 “orthotomeo” to make straight, cut, to DISSECT!

        Ephesians 6:13-14 “Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God,
        that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done
        all, to stand. STAND therefore, having your loins girt about with
        TRUTH”… emphasis added.

        2 Timothy 3:16-17 “All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and
        is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for
        instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect,
        thoroughly furnished unto all good works.”

        PROVERBS 18;1-2 ”Through desire a man, having separated himself,
        seeketh and intermeddleth with all wisdom. A fool hath no delight in
        understanding, but that his heart may discover itself”.

        Proverbs 1:7 “The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but
        fools despise wisdom and instruction”.

        Proverbs 1:20-22 Wisdom crieth without; she uttereth her voice in the
        streets: She crieth in the chief place of concourse, in the openings
        of the gates: in the city she uttereth her words, saying, How long,
        ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in
        their scorning, and fools hate knowledge?”

        In 1970 at age 14, I received the best advice that any Christian can
        receive, be they young or old, and that was to read my Bible and
        believe it, that it IS the Word Of God! And so, much to the
        consternation of ALL of the preachers that I have met, I did just
        that. As a “CHILD” of God, we should trust that our Father does not lie, and is able to do ALL HE said in HIS word!

        Deuteronomy 32:8-10 8 When the Most High divided to the nations their
        inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of
        the people according to the number of the children of Israel. For the
        Lord’s portion is his people; Jacob is the lot of his inheritance.
        He found him in a desert land, and in the waste howling wilderness;
        he led him about, he instructed him, he kept him as the apple of his
        eye”. (TO Jack Van Empy and Hal Lindsey THAT is to JACOB not JEWS)

        So as I read ALL of what God said of Jacob/ISRAEL, and I looked at what the world said, it was very plain to me, that ISRAEL was more than just the JEWS! I could SEE that what God said of ISRAEL was a description of the Western Nations. And so with years of Study and Research, I have proven the word of God, with the WORD Of GOD!

        I have been scorned and ridiculed, by the willing IGNORant, for the most part, yet not ever being refuted or shown ANY errors. I have been slandered and had people miss-represent what I say, calling me a “Jew Hater” even tho I point out that there may be some JEWS to day that are of JUDAH, and I am pointing to those that Jesus said “are of the Synagogue Satan”, as Jesus knew they were impostors, and not of JACOB!

        I have been called a “Racist” because the A.D.L. with their attack dogs the F.B.I. have infiltrated the so called “Christian Identity Movement”(C.I.) (SEE Hal Turner) and injected profoundly racist rhetoric, and have associated that ‘Movement’ with outrageous RACIST’S like the ARYAN NATION! That infiltration by the A.D.L. is a very effective tactic they use to Demonize the truth and truth tellers! most C.I. adherents claim that only the White Nations and White Man can be saved, but they are prideful fools that have lost sight of Christ and do not understand that John 3:16 is for ALL that believe in HIM! C.I. take scripture out of context solely to perpetuate their hatred of JEWS. The Book of ESTHER is a big example of that. C.I. have become HITLER Worshipers.

        But the job the A.D.L. has done Demonizing the truth, has been very effective. I tell people these things that are done by the A.D.L. but they continue to parrot them, and still can not refute or show errors in what I have presented! There are many source’s for information about EDOM and OUR TRUE ISRAEL IDENTITY, but I am about the only one actively working to expose those anti-Christ EDOMITES, in an attempt to warn the people that as True ISRAEL, EDOM is still our ENEMY! They are blessing as “Gods Chosen” the very ones that are implementing the N.W.O. and the Bible says that IF we Bless Antichrists, we make ourselves partakers of their sins!

        2 John 10-11 “If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed for he that biddeth him God speed is PARTAKER IN HIS EVIL DEEDS.” emphasis added.

        Revelation 11:8 “And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the
        great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also
        our Lord was crucified”.
        THAT is what Jerusalem is today!

        EDOMS “Zionism” is Prophesied in scripture.
        http://www.edomsthorn.wordpress.com

        WHY do Christians ignore what I have presented when I share it here and else where on the WEB? Why, when I have no,t nor can I be, REFUTED, wont Christians embrace and STAND in the truth? The Book of OBADIAH says that the Israelite Nations WILL awaken to EDOM N.W.O. I am trying to help that awakening come about!

        Will their “stopped up ears” in the end, bring them to >>>
        Proverbs 1:28-29 “Then shall they call upon me, but I will not
        answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me: For
        that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the
        Lord”…

        YOU DO NOT SEE AMERICA IN SCRIPTURE BECAUSE YOU DO NOT SEE TRUE ISRAEL! GOD was able to do all HE said concerning ISRAEL!
        Why don’t these scriptures fit the so called “Gods Chosen”?
        http://www.edomsthorn.wordpress.com/why-dont-these-scriptures-fit-the-so-called-gods-chosen
        EXPOSING the Gods CHOSEN™ People MYTH

        Thank you for your careful consideration J.M.

        I.H.S.

        E.T.

         
    • J.M.

      February 7, 2014 at 3:19 PM

      To:Edoms Thorn,

      I agreed with everything I read on your website. The reason I agreed was because I understood it the same as you. I tried to answer/respond to your message of which I was grateful to receive from you. For over an hour all I saw was, “posting comment” but, it never posted. I laid down to take a nap. about 2 hours later, STILL, all I saw was, “posting comment.” In other words, my message to you would not post. I went to bed. I cannot remember why, the next day, I neglected to show you the courtesy of trying again, but I was distracted by other things that were transpiring. I have a lot of pressure on me about other problems I am having, but all I can do is apologize to you. I will not ask for your forgiveness because after your message to me a few hours ago, I know now how you really feel & think about me. You also commented that you too were having posting problems. That message from you posted. My message to you would not post whatsoever. So, my posting problems were worse than yours.You understood my message I sent a few hours ago, in complete reversal of what I meant but I will take the blame for that simply because I do not have the ability to express myself adequately, this meaning, I do not know how to write a message that everybody will understand & know exactly what I am saying. I apologize for my falling short in that department too. But, what I still do not understand, for one thing, is, BIG deference v. BIG difference. I also do not understand why you would take the time & effort to give a thorough expose on a matter to who you consider to be/is a troll & someone just needing attention & someone who is not, in your opinion an adult. We had only exchanged comments 2 times BEFORE my comment to you & your response a few hours ago on the last thread at this time on this blog. After you feel & think about me as you do, I’m going to re-read & study articles on your website that I agreed with to at least try & see what I must have overlooked,etc. I used your user ID in all caps to respect you because that’s how you EDOMS THORN use it. I honestly thought if I wrote Edoms Thorn, in upper & lower case it would or it might upset you. Dear sir, you understood 100% in reverse what I was saying in my message to you a few hours ago. I thought if anyone would have the depth of perception to SEE what I was saying, you would. Did you see my comment on the last thread, >Re: Deut. 28. ?? I posted that before you said anything about Deut. 28, at least I think I did. My, Re;Deut. 28 was in response to something Christian Gains said, this I do know. Once again, E.T. I agreed with everything I read on your website. The reason I agreed was because I understood it the same as you even tho we both may be in error. Shalom,dear one

       
      • EDOMS THORN

        February 7, 2014 at 4:41 PM

        J.M.

        Gee. We can discuss this comment of yours, but later. For now tho, I did not call you a “TROLL I said, …”That is a characteristic of a TROLL”…

        AND Christian Gains said, …”And, Edoms Thorn is ABSOLUTELY correct in referring to Deut. 28″…
        So that is TWO times that your reading comprehension skills appear to be questionable.

        I am working on a very important article to post at my site and a comment at another site, both of which are concerning “Christian Identity” and the BIG Difference*. I will try to respond this evening.

        E.T.

         
    • J.M.

      February 10, 2014 at 11:29 PM

      To:Edoms Thorn,

      After further thought on the matter where you say my reading skills appear to questionable, I think it would be more accurate to say, my overlooking certain things is evident. This does not have anything to do with my reading comprehension skills that appear to be questionable, because It’s not fair to say my reading comprehension skills are or appear to be questionable on something or about something that I have never read. I do make the mistake quite often of commenting on what someone has written before I have read the entire comment & this is not good but I am trying to overcome that flaw too. I do have a lot of flaws & so much so it overwhelms me. I’m still trusting & trying, as Phil (Duck Hunter) says to do. HOWEVER, OVERALL, my reading comprehension skills probably are questionable and in addition, to, & on top of that, I have overlooking problems.

       
      • J.M.

        February 11, 2014 at 2:13 AM

        E.T.,
        AND, in addition to my reading skills & how bad they are, my writing skills are just as bad if not worse although you, E. T. may say this is impossible for anything to be worse than my questionable reading skills. I put periods where there should be a question mark, I put commas where there should be a period, & I put commas in the wrong sections of sentences which makes the meaning entirely different, for example, Verily I say unto you, today you will be with me in paradise. Now, watch what a comma can do. Verily I say unto you today, you shall be with me in paradise. A comma can make the same sentence mean 2 different things. It depends on where we put the comma. Another problem is my eyesight. It too is not very good. Also my monitor is so bright I cannot see periods or commas or question marks,at times. I sometimes think & feel that I am nothing more than someone going to hell in a hand basket made in China. I get a lot of help from some people bringing me down to this conclusion. Have you received my emails yet???
        Oh yes, my spelling is sometimes horrific too.But, please tell me, what does BIG deference mean?

         
  12. J.M.

    January 27, 2014 at 2:04 AM

    Christian Gains,
    What does “simplicity in Christ” mean?The Apostle Paul says that there is a. danger that our minds might be “corrupted” FROM that simplicity.

    But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
    .

    Are we getting side-tracked by the superficial and secondary? Do we need to return to the main menu: the exquisite simplicity of the Gospel?

    The plain as the nose on your face scriptures are ignored. God says, Remember and we as his people, overall, forget. He says don’t do this & that & we do this & that
    God says This day is & we say ahh what difference does it make which day it is, I’ll do it next Thursday.Another says I’ll make a stab at it Friday afternoon. Really a great way to keep things in order ain’t it.

    What does this simplicity that is in Christ, mean to you?.

     
    • Christian Gains

      January 27, 2014 at 1:47 PM

      Well J.M., I think possibly you’re at a point in Spiritual growth that Paul dealt with, with the Hebrew Christians, and not at the point of Christian development that the folks in Corinth were.

      In Hebrews 5, Paul’s trying to explain the significance of Melchisa’e’dec, [5:6 – 11& Chap.7], to the Hebrews. But, it’s the last statement in verse 11, and verses 12 – 14 that goes to your point].

      The “simplicity in Christ” (II Cor.11:3).

      First: In the Hebrews exhortation, Paul is speaking to people who’ve been taught the Old Testament all of their lives, and so, SHOULD be mature in their spiritual walk. Whereas, in the II Corinthians exhortation, he’s speaking to NEW “BABES”.

      Now, note verses 13 &14, in Heb.5 Here you find the definition “of full age”, and those who are “in need of milk”. Then Paul goes on, in Heb.6:1 – 3 to detail those “first principles” that he mentioned in 5:12… Those “first principles” ARE the “simplicity of Christ”. But! Note also, that Paul is chastening the Hebrews, but simply warning the Corinthians. Why? Because, (as Paul explains in Heb.5:13 & 14), there are two degrees of Spiritual growth being dealt with in these two Epistles.

      As you know, children are not expected to know what adults know, through experience. Children do stupid things, MOSTLY because they’re ignorant of the potential consequences. So, the adults around them must warn them. But, once a person has reached “adulthood”, (and the age OFTEN differs, as it’s more a case of the degree of accepting responsibility, and accountability, and learning from one’s mistakes, that defines an adult).

      The Family of Christ is pretty much the same…children, “babes” are pretty ignorant of the Devil’s device, and therefore, need “the milk of the Word”; whereas, “adults”, [or, those “of full age”, as Paul phrases it], should be able to learn deeper, and more “meaty” lessons and doctrine.

      In the II Cor.11:1 – 5 (actually the entire Chapter, but 1 thru 5 will suffice to make my point), Paul is warning “babes” to not get distracted by ” …he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, who we [Paul] have not preached”…And also, that they not “receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or, another Gospel, which ye have not accepted”.

      You see, he’s warning them of “wolves in sheep’s clothing”. But!

      Now, let’s return to the Hebrews Epistle, Chap.5.

      Here we see Paul CLEARLY admonishing the brethren that they are NOT what they SHOULD be in their spiritual growth. They are “dull of hearing”…”…when ye OUGHT be TEACHERS, ye have need that one teach you again which be the FIRST PRINCIPLES of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk and not meat”.

      So J.M., the “simplicity in Christ” refers to the idea that a “babe”should stick to milk until your an adult, and SHOULD be a teacher, who can (not only digest), but teach the meatier principles of Faith. Now, look at Chap.6; verse one…”Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go onto perfection, and not laying again the…” (and he begins detailing the “first principles of the oracles of God”). Then he says, in verse 3: “And, this, (leaving the foundation principles and moving on to perfection), we will do, if God permit”.

      I believe, J.M. what we are doing here is “moving on to perfection”…Having FULLY assimilated the “first principles”, we now need to delve into the more profound realm of the spiritual world, and learn the “big boy” lessons, and learn to “commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also” [II Tim.2:2]…because we are NOT “dull of hearing”, and NOT “in need that a teacher teach us again the first principles…” .

      Trust me J.M., learning what is TRUE DOCTRINE, and what is FALSE is not getting “tripped off”, (as some might think), but, it IS LEARNING TRUTH to share with others, to protect them.

      I pray that this is helpful!

       
      • EDOMS THORN

        January 27, 2014 at 8:40 PM

        Christian Gains

        Thank you for your kind remarks and honest opinions. Tomorrow the 28th will be one year ago that I posted that article “EDOM: The Story Of Jacob And Israel Is Not Just A Story”. I have had 7763 total visitors with 8,924 views on that article. Of those visitors 4632 came to my site by way of their own ‘search terms’. That my not seem like a lot, but it speaks to the fact that they find EDOM to be of importance in these latter days! I find that makes what I have done there to be worth the effort and I am grateful that WordPress is here for us to use. It is free and not hard to operate, If some one has some thing they want to share W.P. is great!

        And yes it is “MEATY” and I am glad that you understand that it has some value to Christians. But I hope and Pray, and I believe, that this information could help the weak in the faith and those with no faith, see that the Word of God is true, as I have shown it made manifest in the world today!

        SEE my comment to J.M. to understand my position further!

        Thanks again.

        E.T.

         
      • EDOMS THORN

        January 27, 2014 at 8:45 PM

        I left out that those are from 114 NATIONS.

         
  13. Christian Gains

    January 27, 2014 at 1:55 PM

    OOPS! I left a sentence out!

    At the end of the “As you know, children are not expected…” paragraph, I SHOULD have continued, after: “…that defines an adult)”, by saying:

    “there’s an higher standard placed upon them, and wisdom, and maturity, and knowledge are somewhat more expected of adults”.

    SORRY..hope this doesn’t confuse…

     
    • J.M.

      January 27, 2014 at 4:26 PM

      Thanks, Christian Gains,
      That which I understand are the “Oracles of God” some others say have been abolished,nailed to the cross. Maybe so, but I just don’t understand it that way. SO IF I am thrown into the lake of fire & suffer the 2nd death it will be because I forgot to remember to forget that the sacrifice of Christ abolished what we were told to remember & by not remembering to forget that which we no longer needed to remember was disrespectful & calling the sacrifice of Christ of no value. Anyway I do not want or mean to be disrespectful,etc. by still trying to remember, what perpetual means & what throughout you generations means.

      Please help me with this, whether it’s been abolished or not. It will be a good history lesson anyway. I like to study history but I also need to understand what I’m reading.

      In Leviticus Chapter 23, in pertinent part, it is written:> Also on the tenth day of this seventh month there shall be a day of atonement: it shall be an holy convocation unto you; ………”

      It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath.

      If the evening is the beginning of a new day, e.g. and the evening & the morning was the 1st day & in this 1st day, let’s say it’s approximately 12 hours of “night” leading into approximately 12 hours of light, how can the evening of the 9th day be the beginning of the 10th day?

      Remembering > And the evening & the morning was the first day, and the evening & the morning was the 2nd day, & so on.

       
      • Christian Gains

        January 27, 2014 at 11:55 PM

        Whew! WOW! What did you just say!?!? That someone cursed you to “the fires of hell” because you forgot to forget the Gospel!?!? — You wrote:

        “That which I understand are the “Oracles of God”, some others say have been abolished,nailed to the cross. Maybe so, but I just don’t understand it that way. SO IF I am thrown into the lake of fire & suffer the 2nd death it will be because I forgot to remember to forget that the sacrifice of Christ abolished what we were told to remember & by not remembering to forget that which we no longer needed to remember was disrespectful & calling the sacrifice of Christ of no value. Anyway I do not want or mean to be disrespectful,etc. by still trying to remember, what perpetual means & what throughout you generations means”. —

        J.M., I just gave you the WORD of the LORD’S Apostle, [II Cor. 11:3. and Heb. 5: 11 – 14…Need you ANYthing else? PLEASE…re-read, and study what I sent to you, concerning the difference between the counsel given to the Corinthians and to the HEBREWS….

         
  14. Christian Gains

    January 28, 2014 at 12:06 AM

    J.M. GOD DAMN any one who curses you to hell just because you don’t agree with their doctrine!!!! You just need to keep studying…keep seeking…keep praying for the LORD’S guidance…KEEP trusting His promises…

    J.M., you’ll NEVER be good enough to deserve Heaven…Ehp.2:8 -9…Our salvation is ALL by the, (G.[ift], R.[received], A.[at], C.[Christ’s], E.[expense]) – “GRACE”, Of GOD!…Just do your best to obey Him….Trust & Believe, and LEAN on HIM!

     
  15. J.M.

    January 28, 2014 at 12:31 AM

    Christian Gains,
    That which I understand to be AND are the “Oracles of God” ARE, as some others say, abolished, nailed to the cross. And some others say if I want to keep on living by the “Law of Moses”< as they call it, they are saying I do not have any respect for the death of Christ because THEY SAY Christ died to FREE ME & YOU & EVERYONE from having to, as they say, observe the Law of Moses. I do not call it the Law of Moses, I call it the Law of God, The Creator & sustainer of the Universe.
    Does this make it any plainer? I will try to come down to your level for communication purposes Thanks for your scholarly answers. Your scholarly understanding of the simplicity of Christ & mine are very different. The things Christ asks of people are simple to understand, but very difficult for scholars to understand. When I asked you before, are we getting side-tracked by the superficial and secondary? Do we need to return to the main menu: the exquisite simplicity of the Gospel? < this was food for thought for you, not me.
    You STILL ignore my 9th day at evening question. ahh Forget it. No response to this is necessary, as tho I needed to say this. Ohhh where would we be without scholarship & where would we be without the 14th amendment & the appropriate legislation power clause. Ohhhhhh. my soul.

     
  16. Christian Gains

    January 28, 2014 at 12:51 AM

    O.K. NOW J.M., I understand you’re question, WHICH IS:

    “If the evening is the beginning of a new day, e.g. and the evening & the morning was the 1st day, & in this 1st day, (let’s say it’s approximately 12 hours of “night” leading into approximately 12 hours of light), how can the evening of the 9th day, be the beginning of the 10th day?” …O.K….”

    This is my answer to your question:

    Are you aware of the Hebrew timing system? That’s significant…

    It was based upon THREE WITNESSES.

    WHY?

    Because…Two Or Three was the designation…(Num.35:30; Deut.17:6 – 7; & 19:15)…

    So, as the day grew towards the night, the “Watchmen” (upon the wall of the City, — in this case: Yeru-Salem) — watched for the FIRST 3 STARS of the night…and then, (once they’d visually confirmed 3 stars), they went to report to the “Captain of the Guard”, and then, to the “HIGH PRIEST”, their confirmation.

    And THAT was when the “NEW DAY”, [MORNING], was affirmed.

    WHY?

    Re-study Genesis 1 & 2, and then, Numbers 35:30 & Deut. 17:6 – 7; & 19:15….There IS a REASON!!! Let me know what you think….

     
    • J.M.

      January 28, 2014 at 1:27 AM

      To, Christian Gains
      It makes sense to me that a new day begins right before the Sun is ABOUT to appear or just before it can be seen on the horizon. BUT anymore, & according to what I am bombarded with, I don’t really know. I am going to try to observe the 7th day Sabbath from the evening of Friday until the 1st day of the week, Sunday morning at sunrise & then that should cover it. It’s difficult to observe anything if we don’t know for sure when it starts & ends. I’m sure you know when but I don’t. I cannot believe in anything I cannot understand. Thanks for your efforts I won’t bother you anymore. I really do appreciate your TRYING to help me. I WILL study Numbers 35:30, & the rest of the scriptures you recommended. IF they turn on the lights for me, I will bother you again.

       
      • Christian Gains

        January 29, 2014 at 1:14 AM

        Sorry, J.M, but you are giving the STATED WORD you’re own personal interpretation, RATHER than simply accepting the STATEMENT of the Word.

        Read II Cor.5:15 through 18; also Eph.2:1; BOTH contradict your interpretation. Then there’s that MINOR ISSUE of John 3:3 – 8. Either it’s the TRUTH, or Jesus is a lier.

        The problem with your above “fleshly” interpretation, is the same one Nicodemus had…looking at, and judging things with your CARNAL MIND. (Rom.8 does a VERY GOOD JOB of debunking THAT habit). The CARNAL MIND cannot understand the things of the Spirit. [Rom.8:4 – 8 & 10].

        We’re SPIRITUALLY ALIVE ONLY AFTER WE RECEIVE CHRIST, [Rom. 8:9]. Then there’s II Cor. 5: 14 – 16. Also, Jesus’ own declaration: “It is the SPIRIT that quickenth, the FLESH profiteth nothing, the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and, they are LIFE. [John 6:63]

        THESE are ALL clear statements that we have a NEW life, IF we choose to follow the spirit, and NOT the flesh. But, our Spirit body, (that we receive after our physical body becomes dust), is NOT our spiritual LIFE! THAT we receive at Salvation, when we CHOOSE to “Be born again…of the spirit”. Take it or leave it…it’s STILL ALL TRUTH.

         
    • J.M.

      January 28, 2014 at 2:03 AM

      @Let me know what you think
      You gave me this scripture & 2 more to show me when a day begins & ends ??? !!! > Deut. 19:15 > One witness shall not rise up against a man for any iniquity, or for any sin, in any sin that he sinneth: at the mouth of two witnesses, or at the mouth of three witnesses, shall the matter be established.
      This scripture & the others you said to study, which say about the same thing DO NOT tell me WHEN a DAY Begins & ends. ANYWAY, I have hundreds of “witnesses” that tell me a day begins right before SUNRISE. So if it’s just a matter of 2 or 3 witnesses establishing a matter, I have more than enough. Tho every man be a liar, let God be true, is another scripture. To deep thinkers I have proven myself to be a liar because I said I won’t bother you anymore. I did not see your last statement, when I said I won’t bother you anymore. but if anyone wants to think of me as a liar, ok, I’m just trying to honor your last statement. but also, you need to consider the source.

       
      • Christian Gains

        January 28, 2014 at 7:41 PM

        J.M. I’m REALLY apologetic that I didn’t see your answer right away.

        Now, Hebrew tradition has always been, (as far back as the tabernacle in the desert), that the “evening” [beginning of the next day], occurs ONLY when 3 witnesses come to the Priest, and announce that they’ve seen 3 stars in the sky. (That’s also how the Feasts are determined). The day of a feast is declared the feast day, when 3 witnesses declare to the priest that they’ve seen 3 stars, to begin the next day.

        That, BTW, is why “no man knows the day, nor the hour”, because it MIGHT be overcast, or cloudy, and they can’t SEE the stars. And that MIGHT delay the Feast for a day or so. It is also generally believed that Yeshuah will return on the Feast of Tabernacles, or Trumpets.

         
    • J.M.

      January 28, 2014 at 7:29 PM

      The Scriptures also say that Satan deceives the whole world. I AM a part of the world in that sense & in the meaning of,”world” like in For God so loved the “world.” Do you think there is ANY CHANCE of Satan deceiving those “watchmen” & they could have been deceived? I’m not saying they were, I am just asking if there is ANY Possibility of this. Where in the Bible is anybody instructed to watch for these 3 stars you wrote about? It may very well BE in the Bible. I haven’t found it YET, wish I could. It would sure clear up this uncertainty, for me, at least. We BOTH KNOW that when God says to remember something, Satan is going to do everything he can to deceive us into not remembering or IF we remember, then Satan is going to confuse the time element involved. I still say, IF ANY evening is the beginning of a new day, then it’s strange to me that in the evening of the 9th day is the beginning of the 10th day. It only makes sense to me that in the evening of the 9th day ends at somewhere near sunrise & THE the 10th day BEGINS. BUT, I am bombarded with everything else BUT this understanding. E.g. A day begins in the middle of the night, A day begins at NOON, a day begins at 3:pm, a day begins at sunset. I DO KNOW it cannot be ALL of the explanations explaining when a day begins.

       
      • Christian Gains

        January 28, 2014 at 8:21 PM

        That’s why I mentioned “Traditions”. But, I tend to agree with that, as it is in keeping with the Creation story, “the evening & the morning were the FIRST day. etc. as far as deception, yes, that IS a possibility, but THAT would infer that the witnesses are not prayerful. From the time the Hebrews moved into Yeru-Salem the “witnesses” were always Priests, standing upon the wall, just for that job…watching for stars to appear. Now, (since the making of the NEW COVENANT (in the upper room and at Calvary), that tradition began to change. Not among the Hebrews, but among the Christians. And. little by little, the celebrations of the feast days waned in the Christian communities. By the Dark Ages, (and maybe before), they were no longer Christian Traditions.

        Now, as to “deception”, and the “whole World being deceived” by Lucifer, you must keep in mind that we are no longer of this World. Rom.12:1 & II Cor.5:17. No longer “conformed to this world…ALL things have become new…being born again!

        Also, Yeshuah SEEMS to intimate that it is NOT possible for the “very elect” to be deceived, even by the wondrous works of the deceivers, [Matt.24:24]. Hope this is helpful…(by the way, it is the “SEAL” of our Salvation, that makes it possible for us to resist and refuse the Mark, or Name, or Number, of the beast, [Rev.13:8 “And all that dwell upon the Earth, shall worship him, whose names were not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world”).

        Also, remember Yeshuah’s warning to not rejoice because the spirits were subject to them, but rather, rejoice that their names are written in heaven”. Lk.10:20; II Tim.2:19; Eph.1:13, & 4:30! (and here are the witness of 3 — Luke, Paul, and John!)
        .
        I pray this is helpful! God bless!

         
    • J.M.

      January 29, 2014 at 10:23 AM

      @ >you’re own personal interpretation
      Is it you’re or your?
      @Jesus is a lier.
      Where is he laying?
      @The problem with your above “fleshly” interpretation…………….”
      Oh my, it really appears that you are pulling your hair out.Calm down, take it easy & hang in there. I ‘m about to give you something that will justify you pulling you hair out IF it all goes through

      To who it may concern,
      Christian Gains & I have been exchanging messages on what “Born Again” means. You are going to have to read the scriptures she gave, & hopefully you will understand what they really say. Jesus said to Nicodemus, , Nicodemus, unless a man is born again, he cannot see/enter into the Kingdom of God. Nicodemus had enough sense to know he had been born so logically he asked a sensible question to Jesus with the understanding he had about birth, & what born means. So, he asked Jesus, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother’s womb, and be born? Jesus answered him & mentioned born of water & spirit, not water & flesh, & in pertinent part, Jesus told Nicodemus, & here is the answer friends & it is so simple, but it’s like being hit in the head with a 2×4 & STILL some people cannot grasp it Jesus said, That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the spirit is spirit. Remember, BORN OF. BORN OF WHAT? Friends, have you been born of the flesh? What did Jesus say? He/she who is born OF the flesh is WHAT?

      Christian Gains, once again, I have mentioned to you that my question of the simplicity of Christ was directed as food for thought for you. Was I fishing? You betcha, & lil darlin you bit the whole thing, hook, line, & sinker.AND as Alfred told Applessence, there are more ways than one to skin a cat. Christian Gains, I care for you & it doesn’t matter what you think of me, I care for you anyway. So I am asking you to please retract your statement to & for me when you said on January 28, 12:06 am on the War of A.D. 1812 thread, > J.M. GOD DAMN any one who curses you to hell just because you don’t agree with their doctrine!!!! < Please retract that statement because I believe you mean what you say & you say what mean & I certainly don't want you to damn yourself much less being damned by God. SHALOM

       
      • Christian Gains

        January 29, 2014 at 2:52 PM

        #1] I’ve shared Scripture with you…AS IT’S STATED…not “paraphrased”, or misquoted.

        #2] What I said was meant in defense and encouragement that, just because YOU disagreed with someone, THEY damned you to hell. (possibly I misunderstood your explanation of the situation, but when individual’s go around “damning brethren” over minor disagreements, they them selves need judgement) BTW…”damning” is equivalent to judgement.

        #3] (J.M., you’re missing my ENTIRE point. You See, (if we look and read EXACTLY what Yeshuah said, it’ll be easier for us to determine what is what. So, let’s do that, shall we?:

        John Chapter 3: verse

        3] “Verily, verily, I say unto thee, except a man be BORN AGAIN he cannot SEE the Kingdom of God”)

        4] Nicodemus saith unto him, “how can a man be born WHEN HE IS OLD? Can he enter the second time into his mother’s womb, and be born?”

        5]Jesus answered unto him:”Except a man be BORN of SPIRIT & WATER, he cannot enter the Kingdom of God”.

        (my veiw: Here come the REALLY HARD verses..especially verses 10 through 12)

        6] That which is BORN OF THE FLESH, is FLESH, AND that which is BORN OF THE SPIRIT, is SPIRIT.

        7] MARVEL NOT that I say unto you, you MUST be BORN AGAIN.

        8] The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and wither it goeth, so is EVERYONE THAT IS BORN OF THE SPIRIT>

        9] Nicodemus answered and said unto him: “How can these things be?”

        (my view again: Obviously Nic is having as trouble getting out of his carnal thinking (Rom.8:1 thru 23). Paul’s ministry was MAJORLY built upon the premise that we are dual realities. FLESH, bone, and blood is one, SPIRIT is the other.

        At this point, let’s look at Eph.2:1: “And you hath HE quickened — #4806 — from #4862 & #2212 — “to re-animate” from #4862 — from sun, [soon], a primary preposition, denoting union, with, or together”; and #2212 — dzey-te’h – o [to seek]}.

        O.K. Now, to be UTTER fair, you are just as correct as Nicodemus…we are BORN into flesh, [Rom.8:20] (“not willingly, but by reason of HIM who hath hath subjected the same in hope”). And THIS VERSE really hits the nail…”subject to vainity” = “fleshly body”. (think about it, we’ve spent A LOT of time trying to take care that it’s appealing & good looking as possible).

        BUT!

        THAT (fleshly) body is NOT the BODY, and THAT (fleshly) BIRTH is NOT the BIRTH that Yesahuah is referring to in Jn.3, and HE TRYS to make that clear when HE states in VERSE 5:”Except a man BE BORN OF SPIRIT & WATER, he cannot enter the Kingdom of God”. — NOTE: He didn’t refer to flesh)

        Now, on to verse 10:

        10] “And Yeshuah answered and said unto him: “Art thou a MASTER of Ysra’el, and knowest not these things?”

        (MY VIEW: THAT is a VERY stringent rebuke! He’s basically saying: “How in the WORLD, did you get to be a leader in Ysra’el, and don’t understand the spiritual realities!?!”)

        11] VERILY, VERILY, I SAY UNTO THEE, WE SPEAK THAT WE DO KNOW, AND TESTIFY THAT WE HAVE SEEN, AND YE RECEIVE NOT OUT WITNESS.”

        (MY VIEW: Oh, Oh! Nic’s in deep poo…)

        12] IF I HAVE TOLD YOU OF OF EARTHLY THINGS, AND YE BELIEVE NOT, HOW SHALL YE BELIEVE IF I TELL YOU OF HEAVENLY THINGS”?

        (My view again:

        Now J.M., If you’re tempted to jump on verse 12 and say: “Look! I TOLD you He’s speaking of the EARTHLY body!”. Just remember, “The WORDS that I speak unto you, they are SPIRIT & they are TRUTH, the FLESH PROFITETH NOTHING” [Jn.6:63]…HE’S ALWAYS REFERRING TO THE SPIRITUAL REALITY, even when dealing with Earthly things.

        J.M., I think the GENUNIE crux of the problem we’re having in this communication between us right now, is that you’re “seeing life” as Nicodemus did. 2 dimensional. (height & wideth), Whereas, Yahwey intended us to LEARN (through Yeshuah and the Written Word), how to “see” 3 & 4 & more dimensional. MULTI-DIMENSIONAL; (from above, from below, from in front, from behind, AND transparently…see the SOUL & SPIRIT.)

        For an example:

        What ACTUALLY occurred in Matt. 17:1 – 7, and Mk. 9:2 – 9? Hmmmm? I mean, what REALLY transpired there?. Matt. 17:2 says: “And, was TRANSFIGURED…”: — {#3349 [met-am-or-fo-o]; “to transform, (lit. or fig. – metamorphose); change, transfigure, transform”} — And, now, look at the description of Yeshuah at that time: “…his face did shine as the sun, and his garment was white as light”!?!

        These are not analogies, they’re actual physical descriptions of what happened.

        And once again: WHAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED in Dan.10:10 thru 14 & 18 thru 20?
        Just WHO IS Michael, the “great prince”? And who IS the “prince of Persia?”? Or the “prince of Greece”? And who was that Mali’kim that was talking to Daniel that whole time…where’d he come from?

        Or, what happened in Bethlehem? What did those Shepard’s see & hear? Where did those beings originate?

        And, what is that “new Jeru-Salem, coming down from God” described in Revelation 21? Is THAT PURELY PHYSICAL? “…PREpared, as a bride, adorned for her husband”? Where did THAT originate?

        And, how about Phillip? ACTS 8:26 – 40, (esply. verse 26 & 39 – 40)…BTW, this Antioch is in Lebenon…Phillip was standing in the Southern desert of Ysra’el [Acts 26], when he was “caught away”…hundreds of miles from the Lebanese Antioch, and much further from the Asia Minor Antioch.

        So, what I’m trying to clarify here is that, there is another set of dimensional realities, that are WHOLLY non-physical, (until they CHOOSE to materialize). And, Yeshuah was attempting to give Nicodemus an opportunity to LEARN & GROW spiritually, by being “born of water & spirit”. NOT physically. Not from his mother’s womb.

        Yeshuah was NOT dealing with, nor referring to, our Earthly Body, He was dealing with Nicodemus’s & our spiritual life being.

        I pray this helps.

         
    • J.M.

      January 29, 2014 at 5:20 PM

      @ 3] “Verily, verily, I say unto thee, except a man be BORN AGAIN he cannot SEE the Kingdom of God”)
      @5]Jesus answered unto him:”Except a man be BORN of SPIRIT & WATER, he cannot enter the Kingdom of God”.

      What is the difference in the meaning of SEE the Kingdom of God v. he cannot enter the Kingdom of God”.
      I said that Jesus said to Nicodemus, Nicodemus, unless a man is born again, he cannot see/enter into the Kingdom of God.
      How is my statement misquoting what Jesus said to Nicodemus?
      Since you have overwhelmed me with your corrections re: my stupidity, twisting the scriptures, making them seem to say something they do not say, etc., let’s just go with the above, for starters

       
    • J.M.

      January 29, 2014 at 8:46 PM

      @ Whew! WOW! What did you just say!?!?
      See, Christian Gains, you even have the answer for me when you do not know if you know or not what I just said or asked. your response to your own question,above, & sent to me, of > Whew! WOW! What did you just say!?!? is included, infra. In other words, the next paragraph is your answer to your own question > Whew! WOW! What did you just say!?!?

      J.M., I just gave you the WORD of the LORD’S Apostle, [II Cor. 11:3. and Heb. 5: 11 – 14…Need you ANYthing else? PLEASE…re-read, and study what I sent to you, concerning the difference between the counsel given to the Corinthians and to the HEBREWS….”

      Why do you give back to me the very scripture I sent to you in the first place?,e.g 2nd Cor. 11:3.

       
    • J.M.

      February 11, 2014 at 2:30 AM

      @ > O.K. NOW J.M., I understand you’re question,……

      Nope, you did not understand my (< you're) question. your answer is proof that you do not understand my question. Your 3 star answer in no way says why or how the evening of the 9th day is the beginning or ending of of the 9th day, when the scriptures say the10th day is the day of Atonement beginning in the evening of the 9th day. You shall afflict you souls in the evening of the 9th day, remember that?

      oh, that's right, you said, WE ARE DONE. I'm sorry, but since I have typed this much I'm going to try & post it anyway. Somebody might read it & have the answer. Yeah right, I won't hold my breath waiting.

       
    • J.M.

      February 13, 2014 at 2:53 AM

      @ >Except a man BE BORN OF SPIRIT & WATER,

      Are you, Christian Gains, now, at this moment, BORN OF Spirit & water? Truthfully, a YES or NO answer is more than sufficient IF IF IF my question is understood. YOU, Christian Gains, ARE, or YOU ARE NOT, at this very moment BORN OF SPIRIT & WATER. Are you, OR are you not? It’s either YES I AM or NO I’M NOT Will you PLEASE just answer in the way I have asked you to? IF you will, THEN I WILL UNDERSTAND what you have spent so much time & effort & energy trying to tell me.

       
  17. J.M.

    January 28, 2014 at 11:54 PM

    @ ALL things have become new…being born again!
    Sorry, but no way. Even common sense says otherwise. Remember, that which is born of the flesh IS WHAT? Are you still flesh? When anyone TRULY “repents, & is baptized, a ” spiritual seed” is planted in our bodies by your & my life giver.” He impregnates us. We must nourish this spiritual seed. This seed can be aborted by us too. But, for those who have not aborted this seed &, you will know them by their fruits, & when they die, they will be “born again” SPIRITUALLY. It’s aka the First Resurrection THEY will have a NEW BODY, a spiritual body. Those are the ones who ARE “born again.” So far, I have only been born ONCE. Ohhh there is so much more that could be said.

     
    • J.M.

      February 10, 2014 at 5:27 PM

      @ Christian Gains says, the scriptures say > ALL things have become new…being born again!
      2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come. Therefore from now on we recognize no one, according to the flesh; who believes that Christ IS his/her Redeemer, & keeps his commandments, and even though we have known Christ, BEFORE, according to the flesh, yet NOW we know Him in this way no longer. Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come.. In other words, We SEE it in a different way NOW because of NEWER KNOWLEDGE & UNDERSTANDING. get the picture? get the picture within the picture?

       
      • J.M.

        February 10, 2014 at 5:35 PM

        @ Christian Gains says, the scriptures say > ALL things have become new…being born again!

        BECAUSE only part of my message posted I will try again to post a part that did not go through

        I,J.M. say & using modern day English re: 2 Corinthians 5:17 ,Paul is saying this, to at least me if no one else >Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come. Therefore from now on we recognize no one, according to the flesh; who believes that Christ IS his/her Redeemer, & keeps his commandments, and even though we have known Christ, BEFORE, according to the flesh, yet NOW we know Him in this way no longer. Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come.. In other words, We SEE it in a different way NOW because of NEWER KNOWLEDGE & UNDERSTANDING. get the picture? get the picture within the picture?

         
  18. J.M.

    January 29, 2014 at 12:26 AM

    P.S. Christian Gains,et.al.
    I have not made it to the “level” of being one of the elect,YET. AND I may NEVER make it to that level. I’m still trusting & trying to arrive there. I am still a babe. I know I am deceived about something(s). What? I don’t know. BUT I am not deceived about EVERYTHING and neither are you. I may very well be deceived about something that someone else is not & vice versa. you say, & may not realize it, that you are not deceived about anything. You are saying that you believe you are one of the elect & you’re saying that the elect are not deceived, at least this is my understanding of what you are saying. I am also understanding that you are saying you are born again. IF I am understanding correctly, sorry, then you are deceived about that. That which is born of the flesh IS FLESH, That which is born of the Spirit IS SPIRIT. ARE YOU FLESH? DO YOU BLEED IF YOU CUT YOURSELF? Spirit beings don’t bleed.

     
    • Christian Gains

      January 30, 2014 at 11:59 PM

      J.M., Just to CLARIFY: I do NOT consider myself one whit better that you. We (those who’ve chosen to receive & believe in Yeshuah’s redemptive power & SALVATION, are the “ELECT”.

      Let’s leave it at this…You love Jesus…I love Jesus…We BOTH want to serve HIM as well as we can. Each of us has a view — Each of us has an understanding of our relationship with HIM, based upon our own faith….GOOD!

      We each need to grow at our own pace…and that’s that….I wish you well, and pray that you continue to grow. But, our communication has become more negative than I’d like, and less understanding than either of us wants, so, let’s let the this conversation end, and wish each other well. Bon Voage’!

       
    • Christian Gains

      February 10, 2014 at 7:06 PM

      Each to his own…Let’s just keep upholding Jesus & His promises, and we’ll let each other’s opinion stand. An old adage that i enjoy: “He that is convinced, against his will, is of the same opinion still”…Let’s just keep leading as many as we can to trust in Jesus…

       
      • J.M.

        February 11, 2014 at 4:46 AM

        @ >He that is convinced, against his will, is of the same opinion still”…

        You did a good job on convincing me that I am a FOOL.yes indeed you most certainly did.But, I hope you understand I was & am aware of of this truth. I did not need your convincing.I only hope I am not as big a FOOL as you insist I am.But, I may be, & maybe even more so than you think I am.

        Proud, arrogant, haughty, ungrateful, mockers, etc., anyone with any ONE of these traits will never be convinced of anything.other than what they can fit into their little 5 senses self righteous minds.

        BTW, Edoms Thorn & I understand alike what “Born again” means. Is Edoms Thorn, another one of those He that is convinced against his will……..? I don’t think it was his will in & of itself that led him into an understanding of what “Born again means, it was his honest evaluation of the scriptures themselves & his willingness to want to understand. IF it’s true that there are some people who ARE “Born Again” still, there is always the possibility that these “Born Again” people can become castaways, then being “Born Again” in & of itself is not the finality of the matter. I know you must be familiar with what Paul said what he had to do lest he too should become a castaway. Paul was “Born Again” wasn’t he? Or was he. Please don’t take the time to answer This is just another one of my food for thought comments. However, I’m still searching for the answer to the day of Atonement being on the 10th day of the month, but starting in the evening of the 9th day of the month. IF a new day begins in the evening It looks like we have a 48 hour Atonement here. Something is not adding up here.

         
  19. J.M.

    January 30, 2014 at 1:26 PM

    @ >The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and wither it goeth, so is EVERYONE THAT IS BORN OF THE SPIRIT>

    Well then blow yourself on over here where I am & you can do this INSTANTLY. You already are aware of this message even before I send it too. Spend 1 minute with me, & you can return INSTANTLY to where you want to be. That’s only ONE minute of your time instead of the time it takes you to keep on communicating with me via the internet. AND when you send a message to me IF you honor my plea to you, you will be here BEFORE your message arrives. Let’s do it that way. Let’s see IF YOU REALLY CARE. If you are born again, SHOW UP. pretty please. You also KNOW where I am. Thanks, really looking forward to meeting you. HONES INJUN !!!

     
    • Christian Gains

      January 31, 2014 at 12:12 AM

      Prov. 12:15; 13:16; 17:28; 18:2; 24:7; 28:4; AND 28:5 — (give THOSE TWO VERSES some prayer)…26:8….27:22….I am neither God nor the Holy Spirit…I cannot help you..We’re done.

       
  20. J.M.

    January 31, 2014 at 1:42 AM

    To who it may concern:
    Christian Gains said to me
    “The problem with your above “fleshly” interpretation, is the same one Nicodemus had…looking at, and judging things with your CARNAL MIND”

    I, J.M., am so grateful that Jesus did not consider Nicodemus to have the same problem Christian Gains says I,J.M. have so “fleshly & had such a CARNAL MIND that it would be a waste of time to “continue” explaining to Nicodemus what he, Jesus meant, when Jesus said to Nicodemus, Nicodemus,THAT (whoever) is born of the flesh IS FLESH, and that which is born of the SPIRIT IS SPIRIT. It seems that Nicodemus “fleshly understanding & CARNAL MINDED question back to Jesus would have made Jesus say, Nicodemus, your very question tells me that you are just too “fleshly” and CARNAL MINDED for me to try and explain what I mean. Also, I don’t believe Jesus would have wasted his time talking to anyone when he, Jesus would already know the man/woman is so “fleshly” and CARNAL MINDED the man/woman would not have any clue as to what Jesus was talking about. I think it’s also interesting that Nicodemus did not say back to Jesus, after Jesus statementS, EVERYTHING in reference to this matter, Nicodemus did not say, I don’t understand what you are saying. Seems Nicodemus apparently understood EXACTLY what Jesus meant AFTER “all” was said & done. Also, I am aware that it is written in the scriptures that the scriptures are of no private interpretation. The scriptures interpret themselves OR are so plain on their face any reasonable man/woman would not have to wonder what it means,e.g. Jesus wept. I do not need to go to scholars for an explanation,e.g., Mr/Mrs Scholar, what does the scripture mean when it says Jesus wept? This is what I meant when I told Jetlag,I do have a brain & I do have some COMMON sense. WOW !!! that upset him enormously. That (whoever) is born of the spirit would not get upset “that” easily.

     
    • J.M.

      January 31, 2014 at 2:25 AM

      To you know who
      I’m a fool but I’ll love you dear until the day I die. Yes, now & then there’s a fool such as I. If I am in the first resurrection wherein I will be born again for the second time with a spiritual body, I certainly hope to meet you then. I will be so happy to see you & we will not have to discuss anything other than what a wonderful friend we have in Jesus. Hope to see you then, Shalom

       
      • J.M.

        February 1, 2014 at 9:10 PM

        P.S.,
        This what these high level “christian” readers & deep thinkers are saying.> whoever is born of the flesh is spirit & whoever is born of the spirit is flesh. AND then they say, NO I am not saying that. Ohhhh,ok then you are saying you are not composed of flesh. Sometimes I am forced to believe that some people get on blogs only to show how intelligent they are. They don’t need to learn anything & the best you can get from them, is another who agrees with him/her. As for me, I am smart enough to at least know I am not very smart.

         
      • James

        August 5, 2014 at 8:31 PM

        I can’t believe I actually read all that.

        You can’t be born again unless you’re dead.

        But the whole notion of rebirth period comes from institutions with a history of corruption, intolerance, racism, torture, sexual perversion, conquest, and genocide that anyone of sound mind should dismiss the notion of a magical wizard casting spells on the universe off-hand.

        Christian/Jew/Muslim/Discordian/Pastafarian you’re nuts if you take any of it literally.

        Somewhat back on topic…pharoah, god, lord, king, thunder and lightening, the sun, celestial bodies, hot strippers with cute faces and naturally perky breasts – we fought wars to be free to choose what we, as individuals, respect (if any) of those; and, in theory at least, to have a government that respects nothing more than the words on paper which enumerate the specific powers, we, the people, the collective source of such power, grant, through delegation to our elected representatives.

        Yes, the system is broken.

        No one’s pet wizard can fix it.

        The benovelent angel kings of corporate america seem largely unconcerned.

        Our standing army of foreign conquest ensures the tree of liberty is over-fertilized, in fact the leaves have fallen , burnt, and the branches are turning…tanks are being rolled down mainstreet usa by local police!

        No rebellion is worth the cost in lives, we’re not a nation of martyrs.

        Only the resolve of the people, in democratic process, can restore the vaulted idealistic principles that made this experiment of a republic one not worth dying for, but rather, one worth living for.

        Good evening, fellow citizens, or peace be with you, or as I prefer: Later bitches.

         

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